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America is too selfish for Swiss health care

By Carmen D. on Thursday, August 20th, 2009, 7:49 am Comments

I’ve just returned from three weeks away from the USA. I was visiting Switzerland as I do frequently. Though still wading through the fog of jet lag, I see that Switzerland and its excellent and accessible health care system is being bandied about as a role model for what universal, comprehensive, private, health insurance coverage could look like here in America. Guess what? The Swiss health care system would never fly here.

There are a couple of reasons. The first reason Swiss health care couldn’t work here? It’s because we don’t care enough about each other here in the US of A.

Let me give you an example that encapsulates my point. NPR chronicles the story of Ellen Wallace, Nick Bates and their 16-year-old autistic daughter, Tara in a segment entitled “In Switzerland, An Easier Path for the Disabled.” As a Swiss citizen, once Tara was diagnosed with autism at the age of 3, she became entitled to federal disability insurance coverage which covers all of her medical and educational costs and also “pays for a cleaning lady and household help for the family, since Tara leaves a perpetual mess in her wake, and even for the disposable diapers Tara still needs.”

But here’s the kicker. Ellen Wallace became concerned about what would become of Tara after Wallace and her husband passed on. Here is what Tara’s social worker made plain to Wallace:

“She said the really key thing to understand is, you don’t have to worry,” Wallace recalls. “The way the Swiss government approaches this is that every person who is a Swiss citizen has the right to be able to live decently.

“For me, that was just like such a huge wave of relief — to have somebody tell you, you don’t ever have to worry about how your child is going to be cared for.”

Here in America, there are a whole lot of people who call that kind of sentiment “socialism,” and increasingly, “Nazism.” If you don’t earn it baby, don’t look my way for help. Except of course if you’re a bank, or a wealthy, powerful individual or enterprise with “access.” Heck, just yesterday I heard someone complaining about SChip, you know the program that insures poor children?

The second reason that America could not recreate Swiss style health care is because we do not like nor do we trust our federal government.

The core reason that Switzerland has universal coverage, a “Cadillac” health care standard, and a competitive private health insurance environment is because Swiss people decided to demand that the Swiss government heavily regulate the health insurance industry and decided to pay more taxes so that the government would provide subsidies to those who could not otherwise afford to purchase a Swiss health insurance plan on their own. In Switzerland, there are basic coverage components, very good by American standards, that all plans must include. Then, if you can afford it and if you choose to, one may purchase supplemental policies that cover things like a private hospital room (the basic plan is 4 to a room) and complementary/alternative medicine.

Can you imagine what would happen if the Obama administration even hinted that a general tax increase would be necessary for universal coverage? Can you imagine how many hundreds of millions of dollars the US health insurance industry would be prepared to spend to fend off federal regulation? Just think of it.

  • southernrose
    You may be wealthy enough to afford another tax increase of Obamas' porportions. But, for most of us Americans it would do us in. I am disabled and have three insurances to cover my bills. But, we pay my bills. I take 33 pills a day. I don't expect the government to take care of me. It is our responsibility. We work hard to make a life for ourselves. We give to our church and other charities. There are people who just don't want to purchase health insurance and can. We are paying for millions of illegal immigrantsto go to the ER. They should apply for citizenship just like our ancestors did. There are some children that need health insurance and there are programs for that. There are also alot of people who just don't want to work and expect the government to give them handouts. We can not afford to place our children in debt. This country is no longer owned by Americans we are in debt to foriegn countries. It would take each person in this country $85,000 to be paid right now (before it goes up, as it is constantly is) to erase our debt. Our children will not have a county or life to look forward to. The cost of everything will be so high.
    Not to mention, our Founding Fathers did not set up our country to run this way. This country has gone from a Republic to a Democracy and with Obama is headed to socialism straight to marxism. We do need Change and Hope in this country. We need the Word of God to return to this once great country. And yes, back when God was part of the family values, people cared about other people. Amen!
  • John
    If you people truly practiced what you preached the world would be a far better place. Jesus would not approve of your comment.
  • jane
    Your comments are so insulting and without any compassion for those that lose everything in this country due to illness. I find it unbelievable that so many people like yourself are against health care reform. UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE IS THE LAW IN MANY INDUSTRIALIZED NATIONS. These people NEVER have to worry about dying due to no health insurance. It is a MORAL ISSUE. I take great offense to your comment regarding immigrants. My parents came to this country after WWII and my father worked in the steel industry for almost 30 years and suffered from respiratory conditions related to his job. We all know what has happened to the steel industry in this country. My mother gets a pension from my father that is half of what she gets from Germany having only worked there maybe no more than 6 to 8 years before the war and one can only imagine how low the wages were than, what a crying shame!!!!!!. Also the steel industry has stripped any healthcare benefits for their retirees and survivors. Medicare premiums keep rising and supplemental plans are costly and don't cover drugs. The paperwork is out of this world and insurance companies are robbing us blind. Republicans are the backbone to these private insurance providers. America, the richest industrialized country in the world without affordable healthcare for ALL it's citizens. A CRYING SHAME!!!!!!. Whose paying for your 33 pills a day.
  • twiston
    Jane, moving to another country you find more appealing is an available option...
  • southernrose
    Jane,
    I'm appalled that you're appalled. I pay for my medications along
    with my husbands insurance, Medicare, and a Medigap supplement. We spend 2/3's
    of our income on medical expenses. Including $2,000 deductibles for
    everyone since my husband's insurance is primary. My husbands insurance is
    primary as far as medication goes too. We don't ask for hand outs. We pay all our
    bills. It's the way it should be. Last year it took all my IRA to pay for
    our medical expenses since my daughter broke her pelvis playing goalie for
    the school team and theN required another surgery. Not to mention the many
    tests and physical therapy they put her through. Turns out my husband has
    80% stenosis in his back and requires multiple tests and care to treat him,
    since he doesn't want surgery yet.
    You talk about your family moving to this country from Germany well,
    I bet they entered this country legally, as did my ancestors. (As it should
    be). So your father worked in the steel business and became sick from it.
    Well there are many people who have dangerous jobs. They work with
    asbestos, chemicals, bacteria, sick people, sewage, and work in the coal mines just
    to mention a few. My husband included, he works with bug sprays.
    You say they lost their pension. Well, so did my grandfather when he
    worked for an automobile manufacturer. Life throws you curve balls. You have
    to adapt and move on. I had a fabulous paying job then one day it ended.
    Now I'm pretty much house bound and can only do sedentary work. My
    grandparents adapted and lived on a fixed income and we've adapted. You don't hear
    me whining to the government. Pay for everything I deserve it. Take care of
    me. It's the governments job. Like the Liberals think the government is
    there for. Nobody ever said life was going to be fair. It says in the Bible
    to work , work hard daily for a living. The Bible says to pray and give
    your problems to the Lord for He will provide for you. It never states in the
    Bible that life would be fair. Just because you are wealthy doesn't mean
    you are happy. Money cannot buy happiness.
    As far as illegal aliens . We the taxpayers should not have to pay
    for their health care. They are in this country illegally. If they apply for
    citizenship the proper way and then need help with health care there are
    programs for that. Mexico should be taking care of their own. Not the USA.
    All illegal aliens should be deported.
    We donate 10% of income to the church as the Bible states to do. This
    money goes to programs that help abused children, non- abortion clinics
    and pre-natal care, vaccinations, low income clinics, ministries, food banks,
    elder care and much more. Besides paying already a horrendous amount of
    taxes to a government that is to big and is going in the wrong direction. We
    pay enough to help people who truly need it. Not some people who are the
    responsibility of another country.
    Yes, I do believe there should be health care reform. There should be
    limits on lawsuits for certains cases against doctors and hospitals.
    People without insurance who come to the ER without insurance for colds, flu,
    and other non serious matters should be redirected to the nearest low
    income/free clinic. They should be also instructed about the possibility of any of
    the family members qualifying for Medicaid. Illegals should be detained
    and deported.
    We do not need government interference into our lives. No where in
    the Constitution does it say the government can force a person to buy
    anything. Obama wants socialism. What he'll get is another Civil War or
    Revolution. I'm for it. Anything to stop this intrusive government that is increasing
    is size and power. China and Japan own us right now. We are not truly the
    United States of America. We are Chipans.
    Not a word that comes out of Obama's mouth can be trusted. He hates
    America. He hates our military. He hates Israel. He hates the Constitution.
    But, 2010 we'll have a new set of realists in the Congress. The evil
    triad (Obama, Pelosi, and Reid) will be gone. A new Congress will take over
    and this health care bill will be repealed and taxes paid returned to us.
    Our Founding Fathers will be pround once again. God will bless this country
    once more. Life will be good again.
    Thomas Jefferson said " A government big enough to give you
    everything is big enough to take everything away from you".

    Take Note Jane, Watch and See who is Right. I am a Conservative Therefore I
    Think. I don't have to find myself like a liberal. By the way you can't
    fix stupid. That's why we will get rid of those who voted for this idiotic
    health care bill. I know I can't change your mind. Talking to a liberal is
    like taking to a brick wall. Have a nice life.



    In a message dated 12/24/2009 10:01:44 A.M. Central Standard Time,
    writes:

    http://disq.us/7el39
  • Hello, and season's greetings southernrose!

    you said:
    "People without insurance who come to the ER without insurance for colds, flu, and other non serious matters should be redirected to the nearest low income/free clinic."

    Mark 11:24-26

    24. Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.

    25. And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.

    26. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.

    I am 100% confident that among all of those socialist liberals is a good number of Christians who pray for the government to do something constructive with all of those tax dollars. I'm willing to bet that they pray with earnest that god moves the politicians in a way that makes this legislation possible.


    I can appreciate that - rather than looking to god (or the government) to be Santa Claus, they are willing to express the true tenets of their faith and act unselfishly.



    I would also temper some of the calls for civil war / revolution. Those who rise to such occasions usually resemble Timothy McVeigh.
  • SouthernRose
    Grandpa Canligula,
    Sticks and stones!! I'm all for another Revolution better yet an Civil War it would have been better if Lee haden't have surrendered in the first place. We'd have our Christian country based onmoral values just as the Founding Fathers designed it anmd you freaks who want social/markisn.obamaism can have it. The War Betwwen the States was not about slavery as taught in the US history books. Lincoln is not the hero everyone thinks he was. President Davis had already written in emanicpation of slavery into the Confederate Constiution. The War then was about taxation, decling of moral values, the start of liberalism in the North, taxes on imports and exports of Southern goods. Lincoln wanted Southern cotton to go to the North instead of to England ,which was offering a much higher price
    Sounds like a copy of present day problems. thus the South should rise again. We have a history of which we are proud of. We still believe in moral values and God. It's God, Family , Country, and Guns here. We will defend all these with our lives.
    You like to quote scripture but, you can't even capitalize God you are nothing but a liberal trying to act like you have some common sense. We can see right through you. Scripture also states that when asked to. You must defend your country. It is your moral obligation.
  • No sticks or stones from me. And as a southerner, I'm not surprised by your perspective of the war. I would not consider myself an expert on the Civil War, though I do question the sources of the information you have provided.

    As far as Jefferson Davis and Emancipation, the best I could find was in a Harper's Weekly Magazine archive link (1863):
    http://www.sonofthesouth.net/leefoundation/civi...

    Orders have been issued by Jeff Davis that officers of the United States Array captured after the 12th inst. are to be handed over to the Governors of the rebel States within whose jurisdiction they are taken, to be dealt with in accordance with Jeff Davis's recent declaration that they are to be regarded as persons inciting servile insurrection under President Lincoln's emancipation proclamation. General Halleck has issued an order, which may be regarded as retaliatory, commanding that no rebel officers shall be released until further orders.

    That doesn't sound like Davis was interested in emancipation at all. But Harper's reference to Davis as 'Jeff' tends to tilt the tone of the article towards a northerner slant.

    But I don't really want to go there.

    I was perplexed as to how the Civil War factored into healthcare. But I did see a lot of calls for Civil War over healthcare.

    I read this on the Mesa Libertarian Examiner:
    http://www.examiner.com/x-9370-Mesa-Libertarian...

    Forcing every American to purchase a product is absolutely inconsistent with our Constitution and the freedoms our Founding Fathers hoped to protect. . . . This is not liberty, it is tyranny of good intentions by elites in Washington who think they can plan our lives better than we can.


    We quibble over whether or not who pays for healthcare. What we do not talk about is who really stands to profit from the status quo. We argue about who foots the bill. We never talk about whether everyone in the country deserves access to low cost / free healthcare.

    Meanwhile, the United States has the best medical care services that no one can really afford. An MRI runs upwards of $5000+ in the US, while in Japan it goes for less than $100.

    (And I know how much an MRI is because I had to pay for one. I had to refuse one for my son's head injury a few years back. The cost of 6 stiches and one head x-ray - $1100. My employer-provided health insurance covered exactly $16 dollars.)

    Canadians vacationing in the US take out supplemental insurance just in case they have to go the hospital here. We sneak over there to buy prescription drugs made in this country. And of course, Cuba (!) has a lower infant mortality rate than the United States.

    What are we paying for? It should be clear to anyone that if the government is not our friends, neither is the insurance company lobby.

    I don't capitalize God because I don't consider myself a Christian (doesn't mean I don't believe in a God - I consider myself a Diest.). I assume that you are, though. Do the words of Jesus ring any less true if they are repeated by a heathen in the proper context? Would their truth or potency be lessened by their appearance on a bumper sticker?

    ------

    I've provided some sources to my conclusions below. Rather than assume that you will ignore them, I hope that you will take the time to visit them, and provide counter-arguments of your own. You have a point of view that I find rather surprisng and would like to better understand. I assume that, since you visit this website, you may be inclined to do your own research every now and again. I take the time to research far-right (and sometimes nationalist and supremist) websites to better understand a different point of view.

    Maybe you will take a few moments and do the same.

    Who knows- might learn somethin' new! I alway do!


    What is a Diest?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism

    The Cost of an MRI
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaro...

    Canadians Using US Healthcare
    http://content.healthaffairs.org/cgi/content/lo...

    Infant Mortality Rates
    http://www.geographyiq.com/ranking/ranking_Infa...
  • "I am disabled and have three insurances to cover my bills. But, we pay my bills. I take 33 pills a day. I don't expect the government to take care of me."

    Lucky for you, there are three seperate insurance companies paying for your daily ration of 33 pills. That's not an option for a lot of people. Since you are disabled, I'm assuming that you are already taking advantage of a government-run insurance or two, given the cost of medication.

    "I don't expect the government to take care of me. It is our responsibility. We work hard to make a life for ourselves. We give to our church and other charities."

    1 Corinthians 13:1-4
    "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
    And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
    And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
    Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up.
    Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things."

    As a nation (and a self-proclaimed christian nation at that), we spend a lot of energy finding ways to justify some very non-christian behavior with 'I give to the church'-type sentiment. I would suggest that the next time your pastor laments how America has turned away from God via its vices, you think about how christians have turned away from Him by handpicking those virtues that suit them.

    "This country has gone from a Republic to a Democracy and with Obama is headed to socialism straight to marxism."

    Obama is not a socialist. He doesn't claim to be, and they don't want him. He's just another Democrat - sounds good on paper, then cowtows to the Republicans when they pout and stomp their feet. To suggest that Obama is a socialist / marxist is simplistic at best, a childish comparison at worst.

    "We need the Word of God to return to this once great country. And yes, back when God was part of the family values, people cared about other people."

    Don't let anyone tell you what the founding fathers thought about the role of religion and the state; look it up and read it for yourself. Get past the sound bites, and you may find yourself quite surprised.
  • southernrose
    Grandpa Caligula,
    I suggest that you take a history course from a non-liberal institution. You will find that this country and it's constitution was founded on Judeo- Christian values.Each Founding Father was of deep religious faith and new this counrty would fail if moral values were lost. READ about it! You'll see that I am right. Iam sorry about you'e story. Yeah, we've all been thru hell and back. We've gone thru or entire retirement to pay for my medical expenses. But, I don't expect a handout from the government. We had a house fire, etc.. The lord never said life would be fair. I had a fantastic job before my doctors said I could no longer work. Yes, I'm entited to Medicare but, it is my secondary insurance as my husband is still employed. I also purchased a Medigap policy on my own to cover pretty much all my expenses. I have to take a drug that without ins. is $12,000+ per yr. I pay less than that due to ins. but I have 32 others. I do not expect nor do I want the government interfering in my life. As for Medicare, well I paid into that for 20 years and my husband and daughter still do. As far as I am concerned it's my money. So quit complaing and go out and get a job. We give of our money to great causes. Abused children in Christian run homes/schools. Abuse shelters for children. Church for ministry and disaster relief. Those are the people who need help. We voltuteer our help to shut ins and to soldiers without family support that our serving our great country over seas.
    Remember the Laord never said life would be fair. He also said he would never burden you with more than you can handle. Sometimes you wonder just how much that is because life can throw you alot of corve balls at once. But, with the strength of the Lord and preservence you will prevail. When times are tough you need to reallly cut back. If you want something you need to work and save for it. That's the way I was raised. I was dirt poor as a child and as a young adult. But, I paid my way thru college and I made something of my self. So can others. I believe it was Thomas Jefferson that said that"A Government Big Enough To Give You Everything, Is Big Enough To Take Everything You Have" Think about it.
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